INTERVIEW WITH NEIL S.
BULK
An exclusive Interview with
album producer Neil S. Bulk
for Tracksounds.com
Interview moderated by Amer
Zahid
NEIL S. BULK is an
independent freelance
soundtrack Producer and
Editor; who has lent his
talents to various
soundtrack reissues and
expansions from such labels
as La La Land Records, Film
Score Monthly, Varese
Sarabande and Intrada. His
most significant output has
been the mammoth 15 cd box
set of STAR TREK The
Original Series Soundtrack
Collection. He recently
worked on Varese Sarabande’s
deluxe expansion 2cd set of
The Abyss scored by Alan
Silvestri and also the
re-mastered re-issue of
Jerry Goldsmith’s The Blue
Max 2cd set from La Land
Records.
AZ
- First of all you are
foremost a fan and then a
producer. What’s it like,
when you are the first in
line to experience and
listen to the original
session tapes on the start
of a new project? Do you
feel overwhelmed, surprised
in addition to the obvious
feeling of joy on a purely
geek level?
NSB - To be able to do this
job effectively, I’ve
discovered it’s best to set
aside any sort of fandom and
concentrate on the job. So
while I grew up loving and
admiring these composers and
their music, when it comes
time to start a new project,
I have to set all of those
feelings aside and focus on
the project.
When
I’m evaluating the tapes, my
focus is on the quality of
the transfer. Is it the
right speed? Is there any
damage? I don’t get a chance
to really enjoy the music,
as I’m trying to listen
beyond the music, if that
makes any sense. And then I
want to make sure it’s all
there and put together
accurately. It’s a strange
phenomenon, but it’s
happened many times after an
album has been cut and
assembled and I’ll sit down
to listen to the new mix or
a master and think to
myself, “Did I cut this? I
don’t remember this.” and
then I’ll look at my notes
and see that yes indeed, I
did work on it.
AZ - You have handled
many projects over the years
with labels such as La La
Land and Varese Sarabande.
How difficult was the
reconstruction of The Abyss
the expanded title after
coming from the very
familiar and short album
that Varese had initial
produced at the time of the
film’s theatrical release?
NSB - The Abyss was an
enormous session and took up
a lot of space on the hard
drive. It was multi-track
tape (I forget how many now,
probably 48 tracks). It had
a usable mix on it so we
didn’t have to deal with all
of those tracks, but it was
a process of figuring out
which tracks were which.
Once that was done, it
became a process of
deciphering the paperwork
from 1989 and going for the
selected takes, the ones
used in the film. The
challenge then came when I
realized how much of the
music either wasn’t used or
used where it wasn’t
intended. Once that was all
sorted out, putting it in
order became fairly obvious,
as the takes were all slated
with their intended
positions.
Many of the alternates were
found on different tracks of
the tapes. Quite a few were
abandoned and never
completed with a final
master take. So the
performances and mixes are
not as polished as the main
score, but they were so
fascinating and different,
I’m glad we were able to
include them.
The original album didn’t
really come into play with
this release. I did check it
to see if it had any unique
takes, but it didn’t. They
used the same selected takes
as the film.

AZ - Technically what’s
the most frustrating part of
starting a project? Is it
the time bound deadlines or
the research work that is
necessary to assist a
project that you have not
been familiar with from the
onset?
NSB - Starting a project is
never frustrating. It’s a
clean start. Everyone is
different, and I’m not
talking about the music
being different but rather
recording methods, what was
saved, how was it assembled?
These are all things you
have to take into
consideration. I’ve worked
on projects by the same
composer with the same
engineer in the same year
and the recording
methodology was different.
So there’s always a
challenge when you start a
new project, but it’s always
a relief, because it will be
different than the last one.
AZ
- Today we have had to date
both the Theatrical and
Special Edition Cuts of The
Abyss on DVD. A transition
to Blu ray HD is yet to
come; although a High
definition cut was aired
recently on TV. How often
were you required to cross
reference these for your
groundwork even though both
have substantial amounts of
re-tracking and re-edits?
NSB - That was an
interesting dilemma on The
Abyss. On all of these
projects, I record in the
audio from the movie to use
as reference for take
selection and to make sure
the pitch is correct. On The
Abyss, I debated loading in
both versions of the movie
but decided against that.
It’s been documented that
Alan Silvestri did not score
the “Special Edition” of the
film so I figured
(correctly) that his score
would line up with the
theatrical release. Then it
became a matter of figuring
out where his score was
supposed to go when he
spotted and recorded it.
AZ - Many cues were
retitled and one cue in
particular titled ‘ Sub
Battle’ was not easily
identified in the new set.
Was this re-edit creation
exclusively for the album on
the OST?
NSB - I wasn’t there for the
production, but all signs
point to yes, “Sub Battle”
was editorially created for
the album and given that
title. On that score, I went
through the paperwork for
the tapes and labeled every
selected take. That way in
my session I could see I had
the entire thing in order
(“1m0, take 148”, 1m1, take
56” for instance) and then I
would go and line these up
to the movie, which I also
had cut up to show where the
music was.
When I
got to the sub chase in the
film, I realized I was
missing slates! We had
slates that went from 12m2
to 12m6, so I was on a mad
hunt for 12m3-5. When I
couldn’t find them I checked
the OST and saw “Sub Battle”
and figured if worse came to
worse, we could get an album
master and use that. Only
when I listened to it, did I
realize it was made up of
two earlier cues (“He’s
Convulsing” and “Crashing
Crane”). Listening to the
movie, I realized the entire
sequence was tracked. It was
just another normal day at
the office.
AZ
- It seemed that James
Cameron’s team re-edited the
whole score to their vision
of the film. This becomes
evident now as both the OST
and Deluxe edition offer a
totally different
perspective. How do you
think this makes for as new
listening experience for the
fans of the score and film.
Does it truly opens up the
whole music as different
listening experience?
NSB -
On The Abyss it was a bit of
a surprise, but in hindsight
it shouldn’t have been. The
amount of music editing on
Cameron’s previous film,
Aliens, is well known, but I
never thought that it
carried over into The Abyss.
And I can’t debate these
decisions that are made
post-scoring because both
films are effective as they
are. I don’t know if Aliens
would be any more exciting
or scary if Horner’s
original ideas were put back
in place. The same goes for
The Abyss. Until this album
was released, people enjoyed
the film as it was, not
knowing that different music
was meant to appear
sometimes.
However, I love when these
albums come out and people
can experience the score as
the composer intended.
Listening to The Abyss, away
from the movie, you can get
the story of the film
through the music. We’ve
even sequenced a cue that
was tracked into the ‘sub
battle’ sequence to keep the
narrative going.
AZ
- The sound quality is
greatly improved and the new
re-mastering is nothing
short of stunning. The sound
is so present and dynamic
and adds a great deal of
acoustic detail that was
perhaps not so obvious on
the original Varese album.
When you go from listening
to a commercially existing
album and then to the
original sessions in
pristine quality- how does
that impact you?
NSB -
When I first get to hear the
new tape transfers, in many
cases I realize that many of
these older scores had
wonderful recordings, but
because of the era in which
they were made they never
had an opportunity to sound
as good as they could. It’s
at that point that I realize
these albums are a true
upgrade and not just, “The
Abyss - Now With More
Music!”.
AZ
- Once a project gets
completed and is finally
released to the public- all
that hype that is created by
the label, the fandom on the
message boards,- does that
make you curious as to what
gets appreciated and what
doesn’t (in terms of
recognition of all the hard
work that has gone in it)?
NSB -
Editing has been referred to
as “the invisible art”,
meaning if it’s done well,
no one will notice anything
has been done. That’s always
been my goal. I didn’t write
any of this music, so my job
is to present it the best
way possible, but to also
stay out of the way. I love
getting the best materials
and working with people to
make them shine, but in the
end it’s about the composer
and the music and not the
guy who cut it in Pro Tools.
Obviously, I’m very proud of
my work and I stand behind
everything I’ve done, but my
desire is for people to
enjoy the music more than
anything else. But of
course, I’m human and I am
flattered when I see a
comment on Facebook or
Twitter where I’m mentioned
or thanked. It’s a nice
feeling.


AZ - Great! Moving on to
The Blue Max- which not only
received a stunning 2CD
remaster from La La Land
(not to mention the
wonderful artwork and
packaging) but also two
isolated score in stereo mix
via Mike Matessino on the
blu ray edition release from
Nick Redman’s Twilight Time
label. What was your
contribution to these
project(s)?
NSB -
The Blue Max was a fun
project. This one may have
been a little daunting to
dive into. Intrada released
a terrific album only a few
years ago. It sold out
quickly though, which for a
score this great, meant
someone at some point was
going to take another crack
at it. I worked on the La-La
Land album first and then we
moved onto the Twilight Time
Blu-ray. All of the
research, cutting and
restoration work Mike
Matessino and I did for the
La-La Land release (prior to
final album mastering) was
utilized for the isolated
scores. This worked out well
because the HD transfer
wasn’t delivered to us until
Friday afternoon and the
isolated scores had to be
delivered on Monday morning!
Nick Redman mentions on the
commentary track just how
new the transfer was when
they were recording that
track.
On
this show, my main task was
to figure out what had come
before. I only went down
this path because among the
materials given to me for
this release was a sealed LP
of the Citadel release. The
Blue Max had five previous
releases before the La-La
Land release and every
release was different in
terms of musical content.
The Citadel was the toughest
to figure out because it had
track titles that didn’t
match any other release and
a later pressing (the one I
had was the first) corrected
a typo that swapped track
titles. So my first goal was
to figure out what had been
released and where. This
meant tracking down all of
the previous releases. Jon
Burlingame lent us his
original Mainstream LP. This
was the original soundtrack
album. Johnny Dee Davis at
Precision AudioSonics
transferred that and the
Citadel for us. I had the
Sony and Intrada albums in
my personal collection, and
John Takis, who has admired
this score for years, helped
me with getting the Varese
Sarabande release. Once I
had them all in my Pro Tools
session, it became pretty
easy to identify all of the
music and come up with a
list of cues based on where
they were meant to be in the
movie and where they could
be found on all of the
releases.
But it
wasn’t always easy. As
beloved as the score is,
it’s mostly known because of
its various album releases.
A large portion of the score
doesn’t appear in the movie,
and some of the album
highlights that have been on
every release of the score
don’t ever appear in the
movie. Fortunately, the
tapes were all vocal slated
(an engineer announces, “1m2
take 2” for instance) so the
score can be put into some
kind of order just based on
the slates. After doing that
step, it became a matter of
listening to how these cues
were used in the film.
Again, I had the movie audio
in my Pro Tools session and
I had a cue sheet to guide
me but they didn’t answer
every question. The
alternate opening to “The
Attack” is used in a
different spot than intended
in the movie, so for a while
I thought it was an insert
meant to come in the middle
of the cue. I tried several
ways to edit it in, but they
never worked. I then tried
it at the beginning of the
cue, and it worked
perfectly. Mystery solved!
AZ
- Wonderful work there. Also
I also really enjoy
listening to the vocal
slates that Twilight Time
label incorporates in the
beginning of the cues in the
isolated tracks. As you say
this is the 6th and
hopefully the last time we
will see The Blue Max
re-mastered (not counting
another re-issue when this
sells out) The edit and
re-assembly going back to
the original session tapes
must have been an exhaustive
process. A lot of detective
work must have been done to
exactly determine which
takes of music were used and
where they were used in the
actual movie and how all the
music was to be edited
together since many of the
cues were not used entirely
or just dialed out in the
film?
NSB -
In the case of The Blue Max,
with rare exceptions, only
the final print takes were
archived to the tapes. So
unlike The Abyss, where we
had every recorded take
available to us, on The Blue
Max, it was just the final
takes.
While
it was fun to piece together
the revised versions of
“First Blood” and “The
Attack”, the real detective
badge goes to Jeff Bond.
While writing the notes, he
asked where “A Toast to
Bruno” goes in the movie.
It’s slated 2m2, but as he
pointed out to us, there’s
no toasting going on that
early in the movie. He went
back to the film and watched
it and realized where the
music was supposed to go,
for a quiet scene in
Stachel’s quarters.
Realizing this, it was
decided to rename the cue
(as a search through the
manuscript titles didn’t
turn anything up) “A Pretty
Medal” which is a line of
dialogue from this scene.
That’s the only cue entirely
dropped from the film, and
it was incredible to hear it
against the movie and know
Jeff figured it out
precisely.
AZ
- A toast to Jeff Bond
then and of course Thank You
for your time.
NSB -
You’re welcome! Thank you
for your interest. I hope
that readers and listeners
enjoyed the insight.
---
Special thanks to Neil S.
Bulk, Marie Merillat, Mike
Matessino and Christopher Coleman
.
AMER ZAHID is an ardent film
music buff by hobby, and a
banker by profession. He
lives in Karachi, Pakistan.
John Williams and Bernard
Herrmann remains as his
favorite composers to this
day, followed by Jerry
Goldsmith, John Barry, James
Horner, Danny Elfman and
Maurice Jarre. He has been
associated with Film Score
Monthly print magazine run
by Lukas Kendall in
particular during its early
days. His other claim to
film music fame is his
involvement with the Grammy
Award Nominated The Danny
Elfman-Tim Burton 25th
Anniversary Music Box
collection set. He has also
written reviews for the
online website:
www.musicweb-international.com
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